What if what happened in Bombay had been attempted in Houston? Or Bloomington, Minnesota? Or any other urban conglomeration of High Occupancy Facilities that would rivet the attention of the world and monopolize the 24-hour news channels? Would New Yorkers or Bostonians or Washingtonians acquit themselves any better than did the Mumbaikers? I have my doubts about those folks. I’d like to think that if such an event was attempted in a Red State with Shall Issue CCW some rams in the flock would have done something other than cower, but maybe that’s just a gun nut fantasy. Apparently Indian police officers didn’t have the stomach for that sort of action. Could American civilian pistol packers be expected to do any better?
A couple of days ago I made this comment over at TBC:
We are all potential soldiers. And we all may be, at any moment, at the war’s front, because in this war the front can be anywhere.
A bit of healthy paranoia is warranted these days. It CAN happen here.
American readers of BC can choose NOT to be defenseless. Patriots pack heat. And every time they slip that S&W Model 642 in their pants pocket or that Kimber Pro Covert II into a Milt Sparks Summer Special inside-the-waistband holster or that Keltec P-32 in their bra, they think, for a few seconds, that today may be that day.
It will take courage to engage an AK-47 wielding terrorist with a hand gun. It takes courage to fight a small fire with a fire extinguisher. The guy with the AK will probably kill you if you miss. Enough of us must find that courage within ourselves to take the shot, or we will be powerless victims, too.
May St. Gabriel Possenti steady our trembling hands.
Nov 27, 2008 – 1:50 pm
I’ve been giving some more thought to the tactical problems of engaging automatic riflemen with hand guns, which are the only firearms Americans are likely to have on them in such a scenario as we have just witnessed. The big tactical problem is being the first guy to shoot back makes the civilian irregular pistolero the target of all the return fire. Probably suicidal unless done from behind bullet-proof cover, from which our hero must escape and evade most riki-tik. The bigger psychological problem is to get over the shock. The pistol-armed militiaman needs to have thought of many things before he reveals himself as a ram among the helpless flock. He needs to have already made peace with the idea of taking another person’s life before he ever started packing. He needs to have war-gamed scenarios in his head. He needs to have been in a state of low-level alert awareness, Condition Yellow, before the Bad Guys pull their AK’s out of their rucks. He needs to recognize very quickly what a group of military-aged males pulling rifles out of rucksacks in unison means, and decide what, if anything, he is in a position to do about it at that moment.
As far as our pistolero knows, he is the only armed citizen in the crowd. In some American cities there may be a squad or platoon or even company of pistoleros in the crowd, but they won’t know that. The first citizen to commence firing will be a very brave person, indeed. Citizen York. The second citizen to commence firing may save the first’s life and change the dynamic of the battle. The other armed citizens add their firepower from multiple directions, and Bad Guys start to fall, their arrogance shattered, their plan wrecked.
Do we produce people like Alvin York anymore? I’d like to think we do, but I don’t want it proven in an American Mumbai.
“The handgun would not be my choice of weapon if I knew I was going to a fight. I’d choose a rifle, a shotgun, an RPG or an atomic bomb instead.”
“Do something. It may be wrong, but do something.” — Clint Smith
“One cannot legislate the maniacs off the street… these maniacs can only be shut down by an armed citizenry. Indeed bad things can happen in nations where the citizenry is armed, but not as bad as those which seem to be threatening our disarmed citizenry in this country at this time.”“The will to survive is not as important as the will to prevail… the answer to criminal aggression is retaliation.” — Jeff Cooper
I am pretty certain that the whole “buddy pair” concept came from close quarter battle (CQB) training. Every CQB trained team member knows when they come to an open door or hallway the point hesitates until he gets a “bump” from behind ensuring he has a wing man for the dynamic entry. Conversely going in alone was considered nothing short of a mortal sin. Back in 96 – 98 time frame only Force Recon (Marine Corps) and the SF community trained in CQB – you had to have a clearance to attend the assault breacher course and the whole bag of techniques and procedures was considered classified. Today Close Quarters Battle drill is standard infantry training and also most likely the source of buddy pairs – although in CQB it is not always the same buddy backing you up when you run a house.
I would like to think that armed Americans would be able to disrupt a similar attack if it were perpetrated in a Red State with shall issue CCW laws. Last year and off duty police officer went up against a lone rifle wielding assailant in the Trolley Mall of Salt Lake City with a favorable outcome. Of course that was a single assailant – fighting in buddy pairs makes that a lot harder to do. But in similar circumstances I would not hesitate to do the same even against 2 or more armed assailants – at the distances these shooting are averaging a good pistol fighter is not significantly at a disadvantage against marginal riflemen because the riflemen tend to spray on full auto which from the hip is not well aimed fire and off the shoulder is defacto anti aircraft fire after the 3rd round. Nobody wants to find himself armed with only a pistol at a proper gunfight but it is better than nothing and with a little luck and some solid training I would think the average CCW holder could stall an attack like this very early as it unfolds. Those who do not rush to the sound of gun fire and hold up with others would be very problematic for terrorist gunmen to run down too. Trapped people, like trapped animals, tend to fight (well some do many just accept their fate) and if you have mothers with children included they can fight very well – especially if they have a pistol and a clue how to use it. Terrorist expected to walk into hotel rooms facing unarmed people who can do very little to stop their attackers. In the United States that scenario would be true only if the terrorists picked a city where the population has been disarmed – Washington DC, Baltimore, Chicago, San Francisco….those types of places with entrenched Democratic machines who, provided cover by a clueless and compliant media, never have to answer for the carnage in their streets when compared Red State cities like Salt Lake.
It is a matter of time before we see a similar attack in America. The group who planned this operation can obviously plan well – like so many Muslim extremist groups their execution was piss poor. Ten guys, total surprise, three days of active shooting, unlimited ammo, and cops who go to ground or run at the sound of gunfire and the total tally is maybe 300 KIA? That is a bad execution of what appears to be a solid plan. But still an attack or two or even more like that launched simultaneously across the country would bring huge amounts of stress to our complacent population and our fragile economy – even with piss poor execution. But one thing all if us can count on is that the planners know where armed Americans are and where they are not. If you live in a Blue State with restrictive CCW laws you are at a much greater risk from this sort of event than I am.
These kinds of attacks are coming and in the aftermath of the first wave it will be very interesting to see what our elected betters choose to do about it. There are a lot of options to include encouraging CCW holders to carry instead of discouraging this healthy habit. I doubt Cannoneer #4, myself or any of the other regular commenter’s here will be lucky enough to see a “buddy Team” of young terrorists pop up in front of us at the local mall or hotel (I carry a full size Kimber .45 when in CONUS just in case I do get lucky) but I promise you if we did those boys would not escape our tender mercies without a few leaky holes in their torso. Sheepdogs aren’t sheepdogs because they enjoy the title – they are sheepdogs because they cannot be anything else. Our country still produces far more than our share because unlike most people around the world we remain free men. Free to own firearms if we want, free to say or publish what we want, and most importantly free to protect ourselves, our families, and any stranger in need – with lethal force. I work with former military men from around the globe and the Brits, Aussies, Kiwi’s, Canadians, all of them know that they no longer come from lands where men can be called free. All of them have a single goal it seems and that is to live in America (I already told them that Ted Kennedy has ruined their chances because they are not poor, illiterate or from the third world) because there a man is still free. And free men don’t let ten teenagers run amuck for 72 hours shooting people in the largest city of the land. Only serfs or slaves would tolerate that.
Nov 30, 2008 – 2:56 am
UPDATE 200812061740 — Good discussion at Preparing for Mumbai in America